Round 9 · 1964

Watkins Glen

New York State, USA · October 04, 1964 · Circuit History · Wikipedia

The race, in perspective

Race debrief

What did we expect after qualifying—and who beat it?

R091964
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19 stored results 19/19 Elo snapshots 19/19 numbered grid slots 0/19 qualifying results
Elo × qualifying → race result

Did they beat the expectation?

A strong driver recovering from a poor qualifying position isn't automatically a surprise. This model estimates a finish from both inputs, then compares it with what happened.

Experimental · v1

Expected finish assumes a classified finish. DNFs stay in the full grid but receive no performance verdict. Qualifying is not the starting grid; grid differences are flagged, not silently substituted.

This race has insufficient earlier history: 0/20 races and 0/200 classified finishes with Elo and qualifying. Estimates are withheld.

0/19 entrants have an estimate. Missing Elo or qualifying stays visible below; a grid position is not used as a qualifying result.

Top 3

Beat the estimate

No comparable estimates available for this race yet.

Flop 3

Below the estimate

No comparable estimates available for this race yet.

0/19 entrants assessed. Up to three per side, ranked by expected minus actual finish. DNFs, missing estimates and gaps rounding to 0.0 are excluded. “Flop” means below the model's estimate—not poor driving. A ranked gap can still be inside the usual error range.

Full grid: pre-race Elo rank, qualifying position, estimated finish, actual result and difference from expectation. Positive differences mean finishing ahead of the estimate.
DriverPre-race EloQualifyingExpectedResultP1 ← position → P19vs expectedReading
G. HillBRM #112195 No error range P1 Not assessedQualifying unavailable
J. SurteesFerrari #32318 No error range P2 Not assessedQualifying unavailable
J. SiffertBrabham-BRM #102210 No error range P3 Not assessedQualifying unavailable
R. GintherBRM #12446 No error range P4 Not assessedQualifying unavailable
W. HansgenLotus-Climax #191853 No error range P5 Not assessedQualifying unavailable
T. TaylorBRP #181965 No error range P6 Not assessedQualifying unavailable
J. ClarkLotus-Climax #92212 No error range DNFOut of fuel Not assessedQualifying unavailable
M. HailwoodLotus-BRM #152035 No error range DNFOil pipe Not assessedQualifying unavailable
D. GurneyBrabham-Climax #82235 No error range DNFOil pressure Not assessedQualifying unavailable
H. SharpBrabham-BRM #132153 No error range NCNot classified Not assessedQualifying unavailable
L. BandiniFerrari #22443 No error range DNFEngine Not assessedQualifying unavailable
M. SpenceLotus-Climax #72236 No error range DNFInjection Not assessedQualifying unavailable
R. BucknumHonda #162017 No error range DNFOverheating Not assessedQualifying unavailable
C. AmonLotus-BRM #171997 No error range DNFEngine Not assessedQualifying unavailable
J. BonnierBrabham-Climax #122167 No error range DNFWheel Not assessedQualifying unavailable
B. McLarenCooper-Climax #52259 No error range DNFEngine Not assessedQualifying unavailable
J. BrabhamBrabham-Climax #62236 No error range DNFEngine Not assessedQualifying unavailable
P. HillCooper-Climax #142145 No error range DNFIgnition Not assessedQualifying unavailable
I. IrelandBRP #42275 No error range DNFGearbox Not assessedQualifying unavailable
How useful is the model? See the historical check

There is not enough earlier history for a rolling hold-out check yet.

The range scales the 80th percentile of earlier held-out absolute errors to this field size, rounding outward. It is an empirical error guide, not a guaranteed 80% chance for a particular driver. We require at least five checked races and 100 checked finishes before showing it.

Inputs are field-normalised Elo rank and qualifying position. The target is position among all race entries, trained only on classified finishers. Estimates are averages, not a unique predicted finishing order. Penalties, the circuit, weather, incidents and strategy aren't model inputs. Historical qualifying coverage is patchy; this is an exploratory backtest on corrected records, not proof of live forecasting accuracy.

The rating ledger

What changed in Elo?

These are actual rating changes. The expectation model above does not change Elo or fantasy scoring.

Largest Elo gain

Hansgen+155.0 Elo

Largest Elo loss

Ireland−151.9 Elo

Largest grid-to-finish gain

Hansgen+12 places

The bigger picture

Championship after this round

Top five in the stored standings. Points include sprint results where applicable.

  1. 1 Hill 39pts 0
  2. 2 Surtees 34pts +1
  3. 3 Clark 30pts −1
  4. 4 Ginther 23pts 0
  5. 5 Bandini 19pts 0

Movement since round 8. A dash means the earlier standing is unavailable.

Explore the season →
Across the garage

Teammate results

Two-driver constructor entries from this race. A result comparison, not an adjustment for strategy or reliability.

BRM

HillP1+117.6 Elo
GintherP4+5.9 Elo

3 places apart at the finish.

BRP

TaylorP6+117.5 Elo
IrelandDNF−151.9 Elo

Non-finish recorded; no finishing gap comparison.

What this analysis can—and cannot—tell you

This debrief is calculated from stored results and rating snapshots. The experimental expectation model learns from earlier races only, using Elo rank and qualifying together; it never feeds back into Elo. It is not a separately reviewed race report.

Elo uses the result order, including retirements. It does not isolate driver skill from the car, reliability, penalties or strategy. Elo seed comparisons use pre-race ratings, never today's ratings. Equal ratings share the midpoint of their rank range (for example, tied first and second become seed 1.5).

Grid gains use numbered starting slots and classified finishes only. Zero or missing grid values are excluded; a position gained is not necessarily an overtake. Qualifying gaps use the latest segment both teammates have a valid time for, never Q1 against Q3.

Lap-by-lap pace, tyre stints, pit-stop execution and safety-car effects are not available in this report. Missing data is omitted, not inferred.

Read the Elo methodology →
19
Result Entries
Avg Elo
Highest Elo (Ginther)
13
Non-finishes

Race

Qualifying

# Driver Grid +/- Points Season Pts Season # Elo Change Elo
P1 🇬🇧 G.Hill 4 +3 +9 39 P1 +117.6 2,313
P2 🇬🇧 J.Surtees 2 +6 34 P2 +66.0 2,384
P3 🇨🇭 J.Siffert 12 +9 +4 7 P10 +85.6 2,296
P4 🇺🇸 R.Ginther 13 +9 +3 23 P4 +5.9 2,452
P5 🇺🇸 W.Hansgen 17 +12 +2 2 P17 +155.0 2,008
P6 🇬🇧 T.Taylor 15 +9 +1 1 P19 +117.5 2,082
DNF 🇬🇧 J.Clark 1 0 30 P3 +30.7 2,243
DNF 🇬🇧 M.Hailwood 15 0 1 P20 +71.7 2,107
DNF 🇺🇸 D.Gurney 3 0 10 P9 -3.7 2,231
NC 🇺🇸 H.Sharp 18 0 0 P29 +8.7 2,162
DNF 🇮🇹 L.Bandini 8 0 19 P5 -88.4 2,354
DNF 🇬🇧 M.Spence 1 0 1 P21 -44.7 2,191
DNF 🇺🇸 R.Bucknum 14 0 0 P26 +9.0 2,026
DNF 🇳🇿 C.Amon 11 0 2 P15 +0.6 1,998
DNF 🇸🇪 J.Bonnier 9 0 3 P14 -63.5 2,104
DNF 🇳🇿 B.McLaren 5 0 13 P6 -106.2 2,152
DNF 🇦🇺 J.Brabham 7 0 11 P7 -112.8 2,124
DNF 🇺🇸 P.Hill 19 0 1 P18 -97.1 2,047
DNF 🇬🇧 I.Ireland 10 0 4 P13 -151.9 2,123

Qualifying results are not available for this race.

Elo Changes