Round 8 · 1964

Autodromo Nazionale di Monza

Monza, Italy · September 06, 1964 · Circuit History · Wikipedia

Kings of this circuit
The race, in perspective

Race debrief

What did we expect after qualifying—and who beat it?

R081964
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24 stored results 24/24 Elo snapshots 20/24 numbered grid slots 0/24 qualifying results
Elo × qualifying → race result

Did they beat the expectation?

A strong driver recovering from a poor qualifying position isn't automatically a surprise. This model estimates a finish from both inputs, then compares it with what happened.

Experimental · v1

Expected finish assumes a classified finish. DNFs stay in the full grid but receive no performance verdict. Qualifying is not the starting grid; grid differences are flagged, not silently substituted.

This race has insufficient earlier history: 0/20 races and 0/200 classified finishes with Elo and qualifying. Estimates are withheld.

0/24 entrants have an estimate. Missing Elo or qualifying stays visible below; a grid position is not used as a qualifying result.

Top 3

Beat the estimate

No comparable estimates available for this race yet.

Flop 3

Below the estimate

No comparable estimates available for this race yet.

0/24 entrants assessed. Up to three per side, ranked by expected minus actual finish. DNFs, missing estimates and gaps rounding to 0.0 are excluded. “Flop” means below the model's estimate—not poor driving. A ranked gap can still be inside the usual error range.

Full grid: pre-race Elo rank, qualifying position, estimated finish, actual result and difference from expectation. Positive differences mean finishing ahead of the estimate.
DriverPre-race EloQualifyingExpectedResultP1 ← position → P24vs expectedReading
J. SurteesFerrari #92191 No error range P1 Not assessedQualifying unavailable
B. McLarenCooper-Climax #162116 No error range P2 Not assessedQualifying unavailable
L. BandiniFerrari #22410 No error range P3 Not assessedQualifying unavailable
R. GintherBRM #12431 No error range P4 Not assessedQualifying unavailable
I. IrelandBRP #82199 No error range P5 Not assessedQualifying unavailable
M. SpenceLotus-Climax #122156 No error range P6 Not assessedQualifying unavailable
J. SiffertBrabham-BRM #142134 No error range P7 Not assessedQualifying unavailable
G. BaghettiBRM #152128 No error range P8 Not assessedQualifying unavailable
L. ScarfiottiFerrari #212018 No error range P9 Not assessedQualifying unavailable
D. GurneyBrabham-Climax #72230 No error range P10 Not assessedQualifying unavailable
B. AndersonBrabham-Climax #62275 No error range P11 Not assessedQualifying unavailable
J. BonnierBrabham-Climax #112161 No error range P12 Not assessedQualifying unavailable
P. RevsonLotus-BRM #192048 No error range P13 Not assessedQualifying unavailable
J. BrabhamBrabham-Climax #42305 No error range DNFEngine Not assessedQualifying unavailable
J. ClarkLotus-Climax #52287 No error range DNFEngine Not assessedQualifying unavailable
M. CabralDerrington #182051 No error range DNFIgnition Not assessedQualifying unavailable
M. TrintignantBRM #102168 No error range DNFInjection Not assessedQualifying unavailable
R. BucknumHonda #202039 No error range DNFBrakes Not assessedQualifying unavailable
M. HailwoodLotus-BRM #172086 No error range DNFEngine Not assessedQualifying unavailable
G. HillBRM #32350 No error range DNFClutch Not assessedQualifying unavailable
T. TaylorBRP #222015 Grid unnumbered No error range DNQDid not qualify Not assessedQualifying unavailable
G. RussoBrabham-BRM #232000 Grid unnumbered No error range DNQDid not qualify Not assessedQualifying unavailable
J. LoveCooper-Climax #132150 Grid unnumbered No error range DNQDid not qualify Not assessedQualifying unavailable
I. RabyBrabham-BRM #241966 Grid unnumbered No error range DNQDid not qualify Not assessedQualifying unavailable
How useful is the model? See the historical check

There is not enough earlier history for a rolling hold-out check yet.

The range scales the 80th percentile of earlier held-out absolute errors to this field size, rounding outward. It is an empirical error guide, not a guaranteed 80% chance for a particular driver. We require at least five checked races and 100 checked finishes before showing it.

Inputs are field-normalised Elo rank and qualifying position. The target is position among all race entries, trained only on classified finishers. Estimates are averages, not a unique predicted finishing order. Penalties, the circuit, weather, incidents and strategy aren't model inputs. Historical qualifying coverage is patchy; this is an exploratory backtest on corrected records, not proof of live forecasting accuracy.

The rating ledger

What changed in Elo?

These are actual rating changes. The expectation model above does not change Elo or fantasy scoring.

Largest Elo gain

McLaren+142.6 Elo

Largest Elo loss

Hill−154.9 Elo

Largest grid-to-finish gain

Ireland+8 places

The bigger picture

Championship after this round

Top five in the stored standings. Points include sprint results where applicable.

  1. 1 Hill 32pts 0
  2. 2 Clark 30pts 0
  3. 3 Surtees 28pts 0
  4. 4 Ginther 20pts 0
  5. 5 Bandini 19pts 0

Movement since round 7. A dash means the earlier standing is unavailable.

Explore the season →
Across the garage

Teammate results

Two-driver constructor entries from this race. A result comparison, not an adjustment for strategy or reliability.

BRP

IrelandP5+76.1 Elo
TaylorDNQ−50.1 Elo

Non-finish recorded; no finishing gap comparison.

What this analysis can—and cannot—tell you

This debrief is calculated from stored results and rating snapshots. The experimental expectation model learns from earlier races only, using Elo rank and qualifying together; it never feeds back into Elo. It is not a separately reviewed race report.

Elo uses the result order, including retirements. It does not isolate driver skill from the car, reliability, penalties or strategy. Elo seed comparisons use pre-race ratings, never today's ratings. Equal ratings share the midpoint of their rank range (for example, tied first and second become seed 1.5).

Grid gains use numbered starting slots and classified finishes only. Zero or missing grid values are excluded; a position gained is not necessarily an overtake. Qualifying gaps use the latest segment both teammates have a valid time for, never Q1 against Q3.

Lap-by-lap pace, tyre stints, pit-stop execution and safety-car effects are not available in this report. Missing data is omitted, not inferred.

Read the Elo methodology →
24
Result Entries
Avg Elo
Highest Elo (Ginther)
11
Non-finishes

Race

Qualifying

# Driver Grid +/- Points Season Pts Season # Elo Change Elo
P1 🇬🇧 J.Surtees 1 +9 28 P3 +127.0 2,318
P2 🇳🇿 B.McLaren 5 +3 +6 13 P6 +142.6 2,259
P3 🇮🇹 L.Bandini 7 +4 +4 19 P5 +32.6 2,443
P4 🇺🇸 R.Ginther 9 +5 +3 20 P4 +15.5 2,446
P5 🇬🇧 I.Ireland 13 +8 +2 4 P12 +76.1 2,275
P6 🇬🇧 M.Spence 8 +2 +1 1 P19 +79.9 2,236
P7 🇨🇭 J.Siffert 6 -1 0 3 P13 +75.9 2,210
P8 🇮🇹 G.Baghetti 15 +7 0 0 P20 +66.1 2,194
P9 🇮🇹 L.Scarfiotti 16 +7 0 0 P23 +93.0 2,111
P10 🇺🇸 D.Gurney 2 -8 0 10 P9 +4.7 2,235
P11 🇬🇧 B.Anderson 14 +3 0 5 P10 -22.9 2,252
P12 🇸🇪 J.Bonnier 12 0 3 P14 +5.9 2,167
P13 🇺🇸 P.Revson 18 +5 0 0 P24 +34.8 2,083
DNF 🇦🇺 J.Brabham 11 0 11 P7 -69.1 2,236
DNF 🇬🇧 J.Clark 4 0 30 P2 -75.1 2,212
DNF 🇵🇹 M.Cabral 19 0 0 P29 -2.4 2,049
DNF 🇫🇷 M.Trintignant 21 0 2 P16 -56.8 2,111
DNF 🇺🇸 R.Bucknum 10 0 0 P25 -22.1 2,017
DNF 🇬🇧 M.Hailwood 17 0 1 P18 -50.7 2,035
DNF 🇬🇧 G.Hill 3 0 32 P1 -154.9 2,195
DNQ 🇬🇧 T.Taylor 0 0 0 P21 -50.1 1,965
DNQ 🇮🇹 G.Russo 0 0 0 P34 -57.2 1,943
DNQ 🇿🇼 J.Love 0 0 0 P36 -122.1 2,028
DNQ 🇬🇧 I.Raby 0 0 0 P31 -70.7 1,895

Qualifying results are not available for this race.

Elo Changes